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 Post subject: Towards an Alpha iso
PostPosted: Tue Apr 13, 2010 3:55 pm 
Hello All,

I created a 693MB generic iso that I think would be a good candidate for our Alpha release. I have posted the package contents of that iso on pastebin. The URL is: http://pastebin.com/hDxcSCT3. While the iso mainly contains an unbranded fedora system with a linux-libre kernel and selinux disabled by default, I want to remove any packages that may not need to be there and try to add some of those suggested by earlier. SELinux shows up because it is a dependency of some other packages installed, but it is not enabled.

If you can post any packages here that you see on the list that do not need to be there because of freedom issues, firmware or feel there is a better alternative for space would be more suitable, please do so. I want to create a smaller iso first than add packages that people would like to see in the default system. Also, if you do find any Fedora branding, please post also. Firefox is currently installed, which I would like to replace with Icecat. Thunderbird was installed over evolution because there was a difference of about 10MB for space needed.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 13, 2010 5:52 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 1:45 am
Posts: 550
Location: Guadeloupe (French W. Indies)
http://pastebin.com/hDxcSCT3 without the dot.


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 Post subject: 90k Package Listing
PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:52 pm 
Thanks.

I also created one for 90k if people were interested. http://pastebin.com/BvpYxcvG I'll post 70k as well. I started using blag at 60k, but I no longer have an iso. If anyone has an iso, please send me the link or post the default package list if you have one available to pastebin. I'll be working on a comparison of all the packages installed on the [GNOME | BLAG | Fedora ] Menus, in order for people to get a visual idea of how each distro looked and to get an idea of how the 120k desktop will look.
These groups are

Accessories
Graphics
Internet
Office
Sound & Video
System Tools


I am keen on visuals, so that we can all see the process in play. Building the iso's Alpha iso is going to take some time, but I would like to have something to show by next month. Please send your feedback often and use the best channel for you to communicate your ideas, but use multiple modes of communication to make use of multiple discussions. Come join us on IRC. I know most of you have a client. X-Chat or Pidgin.


Junichirô wrote:


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 Post subject: Re: Towards an Alpha iso
PostPosted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:49 am 
BLAG Users,

I have uploaded some images of the latest LiveCD that I am working on to http://tearms.dyndns.org. It's at the very bottom, listed under April 19 2010. These images represent mostly the main applications you can expect on the next CD. I will post the link for the package list momentarily

Please post what you think.


tearms wrote:
Hello All,

I created a 693MB generic iso that I think would be a good candidate for our Alpha release. I have posted the package contents of that iso on pastebin. The URL is: http://pastebin.com/hDxcSCT3. While the iso mainly contains an unbranded fedora system with a linux-libre kernel and selinux disabled by default, I want to remove any packages that may not need to be there and try to add some of those suggested by earlier. SELinux shows up because it is a dependency of some other packages installed, but it is not enabled.

If you can post any packages here that you see on the list that do not need to be there because of freedom issues, firmware or feel there is a better alternative for space would be more suitable, please do so. I want to create a smaller iso first than add packages that people would like to see in the default system. Also, if you do find any Fedora branding, please post also. Firefox is currently installed, which I would like to replace with Icecat. Thunderbird was installed over evolution because there was a difference of about 10MB for space needed.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 7:58 am 
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Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 5:15 am
Posts: 125
Location: Western Australia
Just perused the vids and shots on your link. Looks good mate, appreciate all the work being done. :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 4:05 pm 
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Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2010 8:54 pm
Posts: 58
We had a very interesting conversation with weyasey about releasing Blag 130k instead of Blag 120k. Why? First because the final release of f13 will be in May. Then, F13 seems much better. Finally, because we need a lot of time, and we could only release a obsolete version if we put our efforts on Blag 120k.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 24, 2010 2:57 am 
Koko,

While, at first I would agree that releasing a 130k CD would be great soon after F13 comes out in May, I think that by releasing 120k, we have some degree of understanding on how we will build future releases. Also, I think there are usually bugs within F13 that may come out soon after and I think with the support that is within F12 presently, that 120k would be stable enough as compared to having a 130k release that may cause more problems. The live iso's seem very easy to build based on the kickstart and I would like to see our Alpha in May which I think will be very stable. In order to get there, I would like to see the current iso BLAG'd and the repo setup, which in both cases would be the case for either release. Fedora 12 will be maintained 1 month after the release of F14(not F13), so even if our updates cycle is smaller for 120k, subsequent releases would be have a smaller window.

I think 120k is our first step as a community and I think from it, we can learn how 130k will differentiate itself from previous releases of BLAG, but also from Fedora. jayeola, mentioned using CentOS as a base for future releases and DasFox mentioned using a ground up approach. With CentOS, there's greater stability in terms of long-term use and support. I think Ubuntu usually refers to this as LTS. Using a ground up approach gives us greater understanding about packaging and other components that I think is important. There are a number of suggestions/features for 130k that I would like to see including:

Internationalization/Localization
Accessibility Support
Package selection during install
New package selections with the distro.

That's all I can think of now based on what people have mentioning as of late. The greatest advantage I see in releasing 130k would be decreasing the release time and having a release cycle closer to Fedora. I think it would also increase the time we have for the development cycle for 140k. If we release 120k by June/July, 130k, I imagine would be released sooner than what we're working on now. 140k would be closer.

When weyasey stated that it took a year for jebba to release BLAG's first release, I parallel what we're doing with the time and energy he spent to ensure the foundation was there. I think we're closer now than a year ago to achieving that and long-term that give us not only the structure that is needed for us today but the sustainability for BLAG's future.

Koko_the_crazy_koala wrote:
We had a very interesting conversation with weyasey about releasing Blag 130k instead of Blag 120k. Why? First because the final release of f13 will be in May. Then, F13 seems much better. Finally, because we need a lot of time, and we could only release a obsolete version if we put our efforts on Blag 120k.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 4:19 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:58 am
Posts: 59
I think releasing 120k as a first "test" would be sensible since Fedora 12 is known (with respect to bugs and problems). And it would give a good idea how people here can work together (devs, testers, designers and regular users).

Perhaps I missed it, but would a single subforum here help? In this subforum, people could sign up or show interest in helping out with Blag.


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 Post subject: BLAG 119k Alpha Released
PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2010 3:47 pm 
Our first Alpha for BLAG 119k has been released. Based on Fedora 12, it represents what our next release 120k will include.
This release is a culmination of discussions revolving reviving BLAG. Conversations within our community by veteran blaggers, long-time supporters, new contributors and users who have stood beside the values and principles of the distribution for a long time.

BLAG is 100% Free Software and this release includes updated packages familiar to most users to get up and running with a stable desktop all on ONE CD.

BLAG119k by default is a LiveCD. It includes Alexandre Olivia's Freed-ora linux-libre kernels. GNOME, LXDE and Openbox are now available for choices of desktop environments. SELinux is also disabled by default. Returns to this release include blogtk. Additions include Gwibber for microblogging. Traditional packages include abiword, gnumeric and evolution for office. Also included are apt, asunder, audacity, firefox, gftp, gthumb, istanbul, pidgin, rhythmbox, soundconverter, totem, transmission, xchat, xine and more.

This is an ALPHA (test) release, which is runs very smoothly out of the box. There are some important things to mention. As we are still working on building a repo, the current CD uses Fedora repos for new packages. As of this posting a linux-libre repo has to be added manually updating via yum is recommended. It is possible that installing some packages may install selinux as a dependency, so please add selinux=0 to /etc/grub/ so that changes to the file system do not take place upon reboot if this is the case. We hope these matters to be addressed in the beta.

Please provide your feedback on the base CD to let us know what you think. There's more work to be done, but this is one of many milestones that we can all celebrate today since it has been sometime since an official release. If you would like to contribute, please read the forum post, "Where can you contribute to the next release of BLAG?"(http://forums.blagblagblag.org/viewtopic.php?t=5078), take sometime to look at the Alpha release and post where you want to make your contributions. Please provide your feedback about the Alpha CD to the post, "Towards an Alpha iso"(http://forums.blagblagblag.org/viewtopic.php?t=5098).


You can grab the latest CD at

ftp://blag.fsf.org/119000/en/iso/

http://tearms.dyndns.org/blag/119000/en/iso/

The current stable release of BLAG is still 900000 and is the recommended release.

The alpha release is meant for "testing only" and results may vary.

Enjoy the remainder of your day and have fun doing that which brings you happiness!

-tearms


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2010 4:33 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 5:01 pm
Posts: 509
Location: Boston, MA, USA
Is it too early to write up something for DistroWatch to mark BLAG's emergence from "Dormant" status?


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 Post subject: Distrowatch
PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2010 4:47 pm 
I would like to approach distrowatch for the beta release. We had a discussion on IRC about promoting BLAG. I do not think its too early to write something up, but I want to wait to contact them. Branding and a repo are two things that are a priority and the Alpha does not have that yet, but that is the goal from now until beta. I too want the dormant status removed. It's been somewhat of a motivator though. We will get there.

extraspecialbitter wrote:
Is it too early to write up something for DistroWatch to mark BLAG's emergence from "Dormant" status?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2010 7:57 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:58 am
Posts: 59
After talking to tearms, I stepped forward to make myself useful in promoting BLAG. As such, I have informed DistroWatch of the efforts we are making right now.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2010 9:59 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2008 4:16 pm
Posts: 84
Running 119k in virtualbox now, and am about to install 64-bit to disk. The installer worked perfectly in vbox (and most of it even in in Norwegian), and the system seems very stable. Very nice work!

So far, I have only encountered one bug: When running "apt-get update" I got
Code:
E: Unable to determine version for package fedora-release

To fix it, I had to make a change to /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/fedora.conf. The section:
Code:
APT
{
   // Options for apt-get
  DistroVerPkg "fedora-release";
};

was changed to:
Code:
APT
{
   // Options for apt-get
  DistroVerPkg "system-release";
};


After that "apt-get update" worked fine.


robert


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 15, 2010 11:16 am 
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Joined: Mon May 19, 2008 10:54 am
Posts: 65
Somehow it doesn't want to boot on my laptop yet, but that's probably due to my CDs' condition. QEMU provides me with something to explore for now.


Of course I'd like to express my appreciation and thank tearms for making this happen!



Now there are also quite a few things I would like to see changed or at least raise some questions about:

tearms wrote:
Traditional packages include abiword, gnumeric and evolution for office.

Afair evolution has no tradition in BLAG. I remember struggling to remove the whole of evolution without flushing out half of my apps on at-based distros. Then I tried BLAG and discovered someone had already taken care of this issue. The absistence of evolution alone was a reason to stick to the distro, adoring it, doing the first steps towards falling in love. I never used Thunderbird as well, but I knew it was a one-step removal, no scattered dependencies and similar clutter.

Rhythmbox, Totem and Transmission seem to come with every GNOME-installation nowadays, but I wonder if we really want to stick with them. Where is mplayer btw? Aren't there more lightweight alternatives with more (useful) features?

A small thing I noticed was that the Preferences menu isn't split into sections anymore. Was this option removed in upstream or is there a switch that could bring it back?

I was also surprised to find this "Firewall" thing in the settings. Fired it up but couldn't decide if it is any good or not.

Finally I really couldn't figure out tjhe greatness of blogtk. Should we set it up by default to post to some planetBLAG?


I'm sorry if this looks like a rant. I just wanted to point out what made me fall in love with BLAG once (no bloat!) and I couldn't see right now, even in LXDE.
My subscription to the ML is working again and I will be on IRC to discuss things throughout the whole day starting from now. If I find the time I would also try to post some possible desktp scenarios for BLAG on crabgrass.


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 Post subject: DistroVerPkg
PostPosted: Sat May 15, 2010 5:00 pm 
You should also be able to use generic-release as well if needed.

veganix wrote:
Running 119k in virtualbox now, and am about to install 64-bit to disk. The installer worked perfectly in vbox (and most of it even in in Norwegian), and the system seems very stable. Very nice work!

So far, I have only encountered one bug: When running "apt-get update" I got
Code:
E: Unable to determine version for package fedora-release

To fix it, I had to make a change to /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/fedora.conf. The section:
Code:
APT
{
   // Options for apt-get
  DistroVerPkg "fedora-release";
};

was changed to:
Code:
APT
{
   // Options for apt-get
  DistroVerPkg "system-release";
};


After that "apt-get update" worked fine.


robert


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